(Encore) JOY: Woman Stands Shining on Remembering Our Sacred Role as Women (Ep. 52)
“Your joy matters, it’s the greatest strength you have.”
In this episode of Moonwise, we share an all-time favorite episode featuring Diné grandmother, activist, artist, and ceremonial leader Woman Stands Shining about joy as strength and remembering our role as women in the sacred hoop of life. Her words feel more relevant than ever and it amazes me how they take on new meaning in the four years since we first spoke. I do hope you enjoy.
Woman Stands Shining is a voice for global peace, and her paintings are created as tools for individual, earth, and global healing. She lives in Taos, New Mexico, and hopes all peoples of the earth "can learn from Indigenous experience and re-member themselves and their own birth-right relationship with Mother Earth." Woman Stands Shining draws upon the deep Indigenous sciences of thriving life to reframe inquiries about sustainability and balance, and she is devoted to supporting the next generations, the “Women’s Nation” and the “Men’s Nation” in being functional members of the “Hoop of Life" and upholding the honor of being human.
In our conversation, she talks about women's role as visionaries for the community and her powerful experience in the moon lodge. She reminds us that in this time of great transition as a species, we need to listen to the women because they are built to give and receive instructions from Mother Earth about how to be on the planet now. She says, "we need the feminine language again." She urges women to express themselves, "the way you think is needed, your language that's not linear is needed, your emotional content is needed."
We also talk about:
Joy as a compass for life
A woman's body as a spirit gateway
Navigating the dark night of the soul
The non-linear nature of the feminine language
How the European witch hunts are connected to the suppression of indigenous peoples
Being a translator of indigenous culture to the modern world
Links:
Woman Stands Shining website
JOY- Woman Stands Shining on Remembering Our Sacred Role as Women (Ep. 52) Transcription
Dorothee: Hello, and welcome to MoonWise Podcast, a space to celebrate seasons, cycles, and rights of passage. I'm your host, Dorothee Sophie Royal and today, I'm sharing an encore of one of my all time favorite episodes featuring Diné grandmother, activist, artist, and ceremonial leader, Woman Stands Shining, all about joy as strength and remembering our role as women in the sacred hoop of life. In our conversation, she talks about women's role as visionaries for the community and her powerful experience in the moon lodge. She reminds us that in this time of great transition as a species, we need to listen to the women because they are built to give and receive instructions from mother earth about how to be on the planet now.
We also talk about joy as a compass for life, a woman's body as a spirit gateway, navigating the dark night of the soul, the nonlinear nature of the feminine language, how the European witch hunts are connected to the suppression of indigenous peoples, and her role of being a translator of indigenous culture to the modern world. Her words feel more relevant than ever and it truly amazes me how they take on new meaning in the four years since we first spoke. I do hope you enjoy.
Dorothee: Thank you so much, and thank you for joining me. It's an honor to have you on the show today. And for our listeners, I wondered if you could mention briefly about the song you're just saying and why it is that you wanted to start with that song today.
Woman Stands Shining: Well, this is a grandmother's calling song and it's calling on the spirit grandmothers from the four directions. So I guess that's sort of a I know there's a word for it. I'm not gonna come up with it right now, but it's a humanizing way of talking about feminine energy from the four directions coming in. And what I say you know, I I asked for a song that I could sing, that I could feel alright about singing in all circumstances because a lot of very strong feelings and very good reasons, I would say, for those feelings. I mean, I understand why there's strong feelings about using prayer songs from specific ceremonies, from our traditions, in public places, being recorded, all those kinds of things, and yet for me, I just feel like I I need to connect with the spirit, with that feminine spirit, and the way I know to do that the deepest way and also the quickest way is is through the song.
So I asked for a song and that was a song that was given to me. And they told me it was a grandmother calling song. And what we say is that we call the grandmother's in and the grandmother's make it beautiful for everybody including the grandfathers to also arrive. And so I I often use that song for public public events, but I also use it in deep ceremonies. So that's where that song comes from.
And I'll also say because while I was seeing it, I was realizing that, you know, I'm going through a little bit of a dark night of the soul again right now. And the image that I had, it's funny, you know, what can inform us. But I was I was picturing Gandolf in the Lord of the Rings series, the movies where he he gets captured by Saruman and Saruman puts him on top of that lonely dark tower And there's one point when they show him and he just looks like he hasn't eaten or drank anything. His hair is all crazy. His eyes are downcast and he just looks really, really defeated.
And then that moth comes by I don't know if it's a moth or a butterfly but comes by and he knows to to grab it in his hand and he speaks a message to it. And that's the the the the medicine, the the helper that goes and and gets the eagle people to come and rescue gander And so I I realized I kind of feel in some ways like like I'm in that state that Gandalf was in. When he's looking all disheveled and down. And yet, you know, there's this fire that's so deep in my core that gosh, it's gonna make me cry. That that that is absolutely true to spirit absolutely true to my purpose.
And and it's it it's always burning. Sometimes it's like this beautiful bonfire that the whole world can see and other times it's so it's almost hidden even from me. And yet when that opportunity to connect with spirit happens to flood or buy you know, that that flame tells me to to grab hold of it and to and to call out to spirit through this very humble way And so in a way, I feel like singing that song here today is that it's because I because I haven't I haven't been singing for the last week or so, which is very very unlike me. That's how I really stay connected. So to have that I guess I'll call it a habit or really ritual before I speak to to engage with you know, the holy people in through song in that way is is very powerful.
So it's a great gift to me to sing that song with you here and for this purpose, for for women's nation, but also for all life.
Dorothee: Thank you so much. And I very much identify with singing as a practice for just connecting personally. And I know that when I went through also a recent dark night of the soul myself I knew that I was in maybe a little bit of trouble or just having a hard time because I didn't sing for, like, two years. And once I started singing again, I was like, okay.
I'm like, coming back up so I'm really honored to hear your song today and thank you for sharing that. And, you know, it's it's interesting that you say that about, you know, where you're finding yourself personally because I think collectively right now, especially we the women and we the mothers are really going through something right now and many of us are in state of grief about our current political system. And I know, you know, a lot of people have known and felt these things for many. Years and for some hundreds of years due to genocide, but many women who weren't aware of it are starting to wake up. To the atrocities that are happening to our women and our children on this on this continent.
So so I just it just seems appropriate in a way to be talking to you.
Woman Stands Shining: Well, what comes up for me when you say that is that we are, I would assess in a pretty deep and deepening into this transition transition of the earth and transition of our kinds, our species. And and what I sense and certainly what I read in a lot of materials that I look at to try to get my bearings when I start feeling like, wait. Wait. Where are we? What are we doing?
Is that, you know, we're there's gonna be some there's gonna be some losses in this transition. And so that is part of the task I think certainly for me and maybe for everybody to like, what do we do with that loss? And for me, I guess, what I'm noticing about myself and my process is that part of the way I deal with trauma is to zoom out really far and get a really big picture of time and place and etcetera. So it's kinda like, I guess, in a way those those posters that are a view of the earth and there's a little tiny arrow. That says you are here, you know, and it's the earth and the galaxy or something.
So I kinda do that for myself, and that helps me to to keep right mind, right heart, right body, right spirit. And and at the same so so in that sense, you know, I feel like, yeah, there's gonna be casualties as we go through this transition. And and it's not gonna be that easy to to be the ones here, to bear witness to that. And so, you know, lately, I've really been talking to the young people, like college students and trying to give them some kind of words to hold on to as they go through that process because they don't have too much experience with going through well, traumatic events. I mean, I'd say that these recent generations have more experience than anybody, but still, you know, just in their life experience and how do they master that So I'm trying to give them those words.
But really for everybody, you know, to what do we do when we witness these losses, these sort of cataclysmic losses and so how do I hold myself? So, you know, one thing that I think about is when I was doing ceremonies in Europe, And actually, these ceremonies were to address the so called witch hunts that took place there, which eventually then traveled with colonialism, both the methodologies used to suppress women, but also men and children during that time were carried on those ships that then set sail to indigenous peoples all over the world. But also the attitudes about and and the the power over mentality, over the feminine understanding, but also women, women specifically. That also traveled with colonialism. And I do believe it has infiltrated even many and we might even say most indigenous cultures.
And so, anyway, I was we were addressing those issues. It was a spiritual directive I was given to to that there was something we could do. And when I was in France, I ended up singing this Buffalo Calling song.
To put these women in a moon lodge so that they could hold that dream time space for our process over there. And the Buffalo song, It was so surprising because what came back was the ancient Bison of France, like the ones from the cave drawings, there. They showed up, and that just never occurred to me. That would happen. They were beautiful.
You know, they they said they said we, you know, from the beginning of creation, you know, the trickster has been amongst you, and we could see that you were gonna be alone with the trickster. You were so vulnerable. Just terribly terribly achingly vulnerable to be to be there with the trickster, and so we couldn't bear it. And so we came to this earth to be with you. They said.
And and what we want to say to you, you know, we came here to be with you, to remind you of fearless generosity because that's what we say about the Buffalo is that they give they they know they're going to be hunted. They give themselves to to us willingly to provide for us our food, our clothing, our shelter. And so so we say they have fearless generosity. Right? And so they said we came here keep reminding you always of fearless generosity and to keep a soft heart.
And they said, particular, we need you to understand how critical it is, how critical it is for the women to keep that fearless generosity. And that soft heart. And they said, if you can do that, if you can keep fearless generosity in that soft heart, then you you will not lose this life because, you know, what was being proposed was that the trickster has been here amongst us and what is the trickster? Trickster's biggest trick. The trickster's biggest trick is to trick us out of this life, and it can't just be taken from us.
We have to give it away of our own free will. And so, you know, I guess my perspective is is that the trickster just keeps presenting illusion and delusion and deception. To get our minds going so that we of our own free will will give away this life.
And that was a very powerful reminder to me as a woman what what I need to do, where I need to be and and and sometimes, you know, I think that's sort of what my dark night of the soul is about right now is just trying to understand, okay, how do I do that? And so there's a lot of new terrain for the women in some ways. Well, as my current grandfather says, it's so old, it's new, So so, you know, this was the this was the bearing of the women, I think, for many indigenous cultures. And then through all this incredible people, we could call it onslaught, attempted genocide, and and and more, and etcetera. You know, that has that way of the of the women's bearing of that of the keeper of the faith for humanity and also maintaining that fearless generosity and soft heart has really been tested.
And so I think we are, as women in particular, being called to maintain that and that also speaks to the calling of the men because the men need to recognize that it's for the it's for the good of all life and certainly for our kind to make the space, to make it possible for the woman to maintain those things. And so those two tasks alone can keep us pretty busy right now if we were to really take them to the heart and and pay attention and spend time there. And I for myself personally, I I make lots of space to do that. And so sometimes I do have to go through periods of deep grief and reconciling and and in order to to keep my to keep holding myself in that honorable way as as a holy Earth's surface walker, life bringer, life bearer, as as woman.
Dorothee: What came to mind when you were both singing and speaking about that ancient buffalo is just how easy it is, at least for me, and I think others may identify what this is how easy it is to forget. And and maybe that's part of what you're saying that that the trick or does for us is that whenever I I feel reconnected and, you know, even just listening to you, I I have some tears coming down my face because it's just a feeling of remembering. Just alright. This is who we are. This is what we're meant to be doing here.
Instead of getting all caught up in just, yeah, the tricks, I guess, of forgetting forgetting that we're all here together to to do something beautiful. And I know that you've often I've heard you say, you were born beautiful for a joyful life. And that's a concept that's so simple, but so revolutionary because it's so different from what many of us have grown up believing and what we've been taught And I wondered, yeah, how you come to that understanding and and why you share that so often with people?
Woman Stands Shining: Well, I I actually heard that from an elder. I went to Diné Elder came to my area. I live over in Northern New Mexico, and so it's kind of not that usual to have deny medicine people kind of publicly offering healing help. And so I went and to to receive a a blessing and a cleansing or, you know, I didn't I mean, there's a lot of always ongoing issues because I I couldn't say I had a specific problem. Anyway, she started working on me and she was doing different things and all of a sudden she stopped and she said, there's nothing wrong with you. That's really funny. And then and then she said that.
She said just you have to remember that you were born beautiful for a joyful life. That's the truth. And so that's that's where I really first heard that. And I guess I sort of gave it my own words which is to say you were born into beauty as beauty for joyful life, and that's the truth. And So, yeah, when she when she said that to me, it really really rang like a gong through my body.
I was like, yeah, just hold on to that. Don't forget that. And, you know, I was speaking with these college, like, you know, their high school students from San Jose recently. There was thirty six, I think, of them, and we were in this Mexican restaurant here in Albuquerque. And and I My friend told me that they were gonna be there, and I let them know.
And so they invited me to come eat, and they wanna be gonna speak a few words. So, you know, I've been saying this to young people for a while, and I've been saying it to a lot of people for a while, but this whole new level of understanding came this last time when where I mentioned those words, you know, you were born into beauty as beauty for joyful life. And I told them, you know, your your joy matters, your joy is is so important. It's it's it's the greatest strength that you have is to be in your joy. And so don't let anybody talk you out of it.
Don't don't let anybody make you feel like it's negligible. It's it's absolutely essential it's important. And and in fact, your joy is your compass. And and I was saying, you know, the reason that I say that to you is because there's no greater joy than stepping fully into the purpose for which you came here for. You know, nobody nobody shows up here on this mother earth by accident.
That's that takes some doing is my understanding. At all to arrive here, but certainly not at this time. And so I like to assure them and myself you know that, you know, you came here for a purpose. You you know, this is not the easiest time to to be here. But, you know, you were, like, pulling on creator shirt sleeves saying, put me in coach.
Put me in. I can do it. I know I can do it, you know. And so some part of your spirit really could see, you know, how you could serve at this time. And so, you know, I I I trust that.
I trust that for the young people. I trust that for each one of us. I trust that for myself. Occasionally, I have to remind myself. But mostly, I I live I'm living in a place of trust of that.
And and there and I feel like in the last I don't know, five years or so. I've definitely, without a doubt, come step full on in the in the full flow of my purpose for being here. And there just is no greater joy. That doesn't mean that I don't go through de peeling processes and etcetera. But but nevertheless, you know, it's it's just an incredible thing.
So so when I say, you know, your joy is your compass. When we are experiencing joy, I believe that means it's this giant clue that saying, hey, you're you're really close to what you're here for. You're really close to what your purpose is. Pay attention to what what's giving you joy.
And you know, these young people were just crying, sitting and I was thinking about it later, and and a couple of them said to me, or no one's ever said that to me before. And and and I was thinking about it. And I thought, no, why in the world would we not say that joy matters to our children? And I realized that probably the reason is because in this modern world paradigm, the power over paradigm, the capitalist paradigm, the well, anyway, lots of additives, lots of ways of describing it. But in that paradigm, you know, I think we have resigned ourselves to the fact that joy is probably not gonna happen.
Are on a very limited basis. Right? Because, you know, it demands so much of us to to be because capitalism really an essential part of capitalism I think at this point or certainly the way it's being enacted today requires us to step more and more into separation. It is not conducive to cooperation or collaboration. Because of the competitive factor and also because of the fact that all of the goodies, all of the fruits of the labor don't get spread out amongst anybody.
They all go to the top of the pyramid, which means that there's less and less and less seemingly. I mean, I'm sitting here in my front yard with about five fruit trees in front of me, and they're getting ready to shower fruit down on me. So that is an illusion about capitalism that that it's scarce, but it feels that way. Right? The illusion is very thick.
And so that that separation piece is so so deep. But so so in that place, you know, we say, you're gonna have to sacrifice relationship probably. You're gonna have to sacrifice creativity in many instances, people feel that way. Certainly, people who are being put through school systems and trying to figure out how they're gonna plug into this machine. And and your you know, so the possibilities for you to to really have joy are gonna be pretty limited.
So your own joy is limited. You're gonna have to compromise yourself deeply like, so deep. And you're also going to have to betray the mother earth. In order to have food clothing and shelter. So, you know, let's just don't even talk about joy.
How about? Because the truth is beautiful sun, beautiful daughter. It's a long shot for you. And I realize that's why we don't say that to our young people. That's why we don't say that to our young people, and that's criminal. It's criminal to me when I think about it. So I'm pretty resolute in in wanting to shout from the rooftops to young people, you know. That's that is not right. When I tell them, you know, you came here to change this.
You came here to change it all.
So you know, here I am talking to college bound seniors or whoever. Right? And I'm telling them, you know, so if you came here to change it, we can all see that this has to change our relationship to everything. Our species relationship to everything. Has to change.
Everything else is in relationship and cruising along. As as long as we stay out of it, it does fine. But it's the second we step in with our misunderstanding of who we are, where we are, and how it is, is detrimental but you came here to change it. So that probably means that all of these systems that are running all around you, they probably don't have the tools that you're gonna need to change it up. You know, so I tell them, you know, these the things you're looking for and what you came here to do, you might not find it in school.
And they're like, yeah. And I'm like, well, you know, you're gonna have to move a little bit slow and gentle because, you know, that's all they've been given for reality. Right? So I feel like as an indigenous person, I at least have this whole other world that doesn't have anything to do with these systems that it's available to me, although they are being encroached upon greatly by social media and institutions, academic, you know, there's all kinds of questions coming up there. But but really, they're kind of outside of those systems.
But but but many people don't have that. This is the only system they've ever been presented with. So it's really important for me to do that. And and as, you know, you're talking about women and their empowerment, you know, the same applies for women because our perspective our way of creating systems, our way of creating relationships. All of that has been silenced for so long.
As being superfluous because efficiency, I love to talk about efficiency. Talk to Meg Pies about efficiency. I'm watching them. And and, you know, for Magpie's efficiency involves a lot of talking. I just had a Magpie land in front of me and just really tune me out a minute ago.
I'm not sure what was about, but or maybe it was thanking me. It's kinda hard to tell with magpie voices. But, you know, I've watched magpie's, I've watched crows, and they they they have to play a lot. And they have to they commune a lot, like you can see little couples of crows, like rubbing beaks and stuff in the mold. Earning.
And and, you know, these guys are living outdoors. Three hundred and sixty five days a year come what may in the weather, the heat. Right now, we're having a big heat wave over here and super dry. And they're thriving. Right?
And so I just have to believe that part of their efficiency has to do with play, community, humor. They have huge humor. And so, you know, this idea of efficiency being moving from point a to point b going in a straight line as fast as possible, there is just nothing in this construct that does that. Nothing except accept us. And so all the other forms of efficiency and beauty are actually imperative for for for for thriving here.
It's not it's not extra. It's not hobby. It's not superfluous. It's not wasting time. It's it's a part of the structure of this place.
And so in that same way, you know, I say to women's nation, you know, you're the way you think is needed. Your logic is needed. It's not linear, but it's needed. Your language that is not linear is needed. Your emotional content is desperately needed. So that's where I kind of kind of bringing this all the way back around to you were born into beauty has beauty for joyful life. Beauty involves joy and beauty involves beauty. Beauty involves delight. One other thing I I I often say about beauty is that, you know, I feel like part of the reason that Western scientists missed so much of the incredible deep knowledge that indigenous culture of truth is held is because indigenous people express that knowledge in beautiful ways -- Mhmm. -- in beauty.
They don't write big dissertations and thesis. They they weave things. They make pottery. They and all of it is describing this deep knowledge. And so because it was so beautiful, Western science missed it entirely because it has been, for some reason, beauty has been written out of their script.
And, yeah, it's such an inherent part of where we are and who we are.
Dorothee: And as you talk about the women's nation and beauty, I'm so curious to hear about your thoughts on what it is that women uniquely bring to this I guess this mission of remembering and reconnecting, I've heard you talk about the feminine design and how the embodied divine feminine shows up in women almost like innately, but that we just need to remember it. I wondered if you could talk a little bit about that.
Woman Stands Shining: Well, I'm glad you asked. You probably know that's one of my favorite subjects in the world. Although, I'm enjoying talking about the masculine role as much these days. But so okay. So to talk about that, I think I have to talk about indigenous people a little bit first, and that is to say, you know, one of my sort of taglines, I guess, at this point, is saying, sustainability is the highest and most sought after technology on the planet. Who should we be talking to? And my answer to that would be, we should be talking to those peoples who've known how to live in one place over an ended period of time, say, a thousand years, two thousand years, three thousand years, or more, you know, in relative health, harmony, and happiness. And so we call these people indigenous, which means they are of place.
And so, you know, I've lived in my little town here for about thirty two years. And by modern day standards, that's a super long time. I'm, like, indigenous to my town now just for having lived here for this long. And I noticed that my rhythms of my relationships are different than what many people experience. For instance, I get to experience reconciliation because I can have a knock down drag out fight with a neighbor over something and feel like I never wanna engage with them again.
And then all the five, six, seven years later, there we are being soccer moms together with our kids or working on a school project together with our kids.
And, hey, that's the last red cherry and you can't have it. Anyway, so then, you know, we have to reinvent our relationship with this difficult history. Right? And then we might see each other again in another ten years. And we're both, like, wholeheartedly all about, you know, making sure Super Walmart doesn't move to town. Or whatever like that.
And so now we're like really deeply respectful of each other and we've changed a lot since that first knockdown drag out fight. We get to witness that in each other. And so Anyway, you get the idea. So things things our relationships evolve in deeper ways. And I just really feel like people who live their lives in such a way where they're moving every two, three, four years.
Like, they never get you experience that. Right? So, I mean, that must create a certain amount of cynicism about relationship, I think. So that's just like a tiny example. Right?
But let's say you're a person who's lived in a place for three thousand years, your people, and all the all the trial and error collective knowledge. Spiritual insight that comes from being in a place for that law gets passed down to you. And so you get to carry a lot of that that knowing. You know, how do you have relationship with place like that? Well, you you have it.
It's not it's not it's not it's not you don't have that relationship of sustainability. I mean, that's a very very sterile clinical kind of word to describe that relationship honestly, but we can use it sustainability. But you get to have that relationship by having a two way, at least a two way relationship if we want to call one party the natural world and the other party, humanity, which is kind of a modern world view of things. But let's say that we're gonna we're gonna look at it like that. And and so you you have that by having a conversation.
It's a dialogue. It's a and it's also oh, gosh, my words are not coming super fast and easy today, but it's a it's a mutually beneficial relationship. And so I feel like the reason that we have those relationships as indigenous people with a place is because of our ceremonies. And so it's through the ceremonies that we get to have these deep conversations.
And the place actually informs us like, literally informs us about what's needed next or what the possibilities are for joy and beauty too. So practical. I mean, I don't want to say that joy and beauty aren't practical. I think they're absolutely practical. But, you know, so so we get informed about how to do this, how to be where we are, and we also get informed about possibilities of how to make it an even more beautiful or maybe even exciting relationship. And so so it's an ongoing process And it's a it's a it is. It's a mad love affair. And and so I'm thinking if that's really what sustainability requires then we need to really treasure and value all of those places where we get to have access to this deep dialogue and conversation with with the natural world. And so one thing that I have come to know in my own prayer life is when I was a little younger and now I'm beyond that time.
But to be put into the moon launch, to be to be set aside, to have all the women who were bleeding, be set aside into their own place of prayer, was one of the most awakening, profound, places that I've that I have yet to experience and part of me still grieves and more and said I'm not that I can't go there anymore. I I trust that there that I am now in a place that's equally as profound and informing and beautiful, but in some ways, I it's not as clear to me sometimes. But anyway, so when I used to sit in the in the moon lodge in prayer, and sometimes I would just do this on my own after I learned how to do it with other women, But it's it's this profound exchange that takes place. We say that we at that time, we're dismantling the holy altar of life from within our, you know, our own body. We are given that gift.
And so that material is so holy. It's so sacred and that time is is is is hugely sacred, but it's also full of possibility because we say that at that time that gateway between heaven and earth opens So biologically, they call that the cervix. Right? But but it's a spirit gateway as well. And so So one, when we're spilling blood, when that gateway is open, we have the there's an ease with being able to receive vision.
And to also hear the voice of this Mother Earth, to hear this voice of life, to hear this voice of the natural world, in a very in a way that we can express in a way that we can understand for ourselves, but also express to our community. And so at that time, we have the possibility by giving this sacred material to the mother earth as offering on behalf of our life as human beings. We also are drawing in through that gateway. We're drawing from the mother earth and and she has the ability to give us profound nourishment, body mind, heart and spirit nourishment, but also nurturing And but but she also and this is what's so amazing. She has this incredible ability to give us instruction instruction for how to be here now.
Mhmm. And and so, you know, that role of the woman to be able to just for her her biology gives her a spiritual capacity. And so she's she's literally made for it. And so she can receive that instruction from the mother earth on behalf of her own life on behalf of the women who are in the Moon Lodge with her, maybe on behalf of the women in her community, or maybe the whole community, or maybe the whole world, you know. And and so I got opened up to that possibility and really experienced it over and over and over again and began to be able to walk it out of that dreamy, you know, laying in the dirt, dreaming place in the Lou Lodge.
And walk it out into the world. And and I became somewhat practiced at that So for me, that's like a normal way of life now. And and and I feel like I get called upon a lot because that is feeling like a normal way of life for me, but it's not normal to modern world. So somehow I'm standing out, but I really believe that and that all women have this capacity. I put women of every race in Moon Lodge, and the same thing happens to them every single time.
And they never it feels subtle at the time while you're in the moonlight. But when you come out and you reenter modern world and all of a sudden you realize, whoa, I was in some other dimension, some other place. Mhmm. And I feel myself and I know myself and I know some things that I need to express to the world. So so that, to me, is a very deep indicator of who the women's side of our species are That's not to say that that men can also be dreamers or visioners or whatever.
But I just feel like the women for whatever reason are kind of called upon to be that conduit and oddly in so many with so many indigenous peoples, because I meet with indigenous peoples around the world, and I go to many indigenous peoples gatherings, the men are given the voice over and over and over and over. And I'm like, well, and sometimes they're given the voice to be the spokesperson for the women dreaming, but pretty dang rare in my experience Good. So so even in indigenous culture, that voice is is not always present. Even though they might have many rituals around this time for the women, or, you know, you would think that it would be a little bit more present. But in many ways, that voice has been shut out So of all times on the planet, when we could use a little direct instruction from the mother earth about how to be here now, I would say we're definitely in need of that right now.
And so for the women to remember themselves to that practice is is such a powerful possibility that I feel is just for the most part laying dormant. There are a lot of young women that I meet who are recognizing that their moon is holy, and that's where, you know, the moon cups and all of these kinds of devices for being able to offer to the mother earth. I don't always hear from them that they're taking the time to to really present themselves to the mother earth and say mama, you know, what would you say to me? I'm here to receive your instructions on behalf of life, on behalf of the people, on behalf of my kind to uphold the honor of being human being. So so we're so there is a whole movement moving in that direction.
I'm not sure that they're asking, but I would highly recommend that So then for myself as a woman who's moved on and from that time, you know, I'm I've been going through menopause for some years. And it's so funny to me because I'll say that in anybody that's got a medical background will say, well, when did you have your last smooth. I don't know how long it's been, like, six or seven years. I'm, like, oh, you're past menopause. And I'm, like So maybe it's just a matter of terminology.
But boy, do I not feel like I'm past it? I'm still like, my body is still working this out. It's a big big deal. But anyway, that process is part of my gift to the world. You know, I feel like I'm getting called to speak at this time of my life more than at any other time. And and I I know what's happening when I was still getting my moon time too. I would always get, like, my mood would come just when I was supposed to go speak to five hundred people. And that's, like, the last time you really wanna, like, be projecting and putting it out there and, you know, and yet it was the perfect time.
So how I spoke and I'm sure what I said was coming from this whole different place that normally is definitely kept out of the public. Right? We're supposed to hide who we are hide all evidence that this incredible miraculous thing is happening in our body and pretend like nothing is going on. I mean, that's that's the rule in modern world for women on Moon Time. Right?
So, no, we have not heard from this from this place. And I really felt, you know, after this happened a half dozen times or so. I'm like, gosh, I think this might be on purpose. And I and I thought to myself, you know, I I really feel like Spirit is saying, you know, the world needs to hear from the feminine, from this very deep vulnerable place. And and I feel like that same is true for me going through the labor of this elder womanhood piece.
So I feel like my menopause, they told me, you know, you're in labor again. And this time you're gonna birth yourself as the fruitful woman. And so I guess the world needs to hear from that place too because boy, oh, boy, I get called on all the time including, you know, in this beautiful series that you're doing. So that was plenty, but there's there's so much to say about it, but but that's it. Definitely a good starting place to think about what how our role is different. Well, actually, I'm gonna say one more piece. And that is that I really worry about modern world right now in this place of gender.
And when I'm hearing from modern world, a lot these days is that there's no such thing as gender. That gender is a cultural construct. It's like a figment of our imagination or something. And I'm like, boy, be careful there. And and I do feel like the reason that People are saying that is because of the power dynamics associated with gender.
And all of the abuse that has gone along with it. But I also feel like because we don't have very much in the way of reconciliation tools. You know, it's just too much to deal with. And so I guess the example I would give is that people will also come up to me and say, I can't wait until we're all just light brown They're talking about light brown skin. And what they mean is, I can't believe I I can't wait until all our races are just so mixed that there really is no distinct races anymore. And And and I know why they're saying that. They're saying that because they're sick of the war. They're sick of the conflict. They're sick of, you know, all the difficulties.
And and and I'm just stunned when people say something like that till they go, like, really, you don't want distinct races anymore. And and and I've just well, as an indigenous person of somewhat pure blood of a certain race, I'm I'm pretty shocked when I hear that. And And I think, no, the answer is not to do away with diversity. That's not the answer. You know, even even Western science is telling us that diversity is the key to life. But how we relate to someone that's different is is definitely a part of the process here. And I do think that indigenous peoples who have distinct cultures that really have been growing up for thousands of years as neighbors and yet not becoming each other like having distinct languages, distinct practices, you know, can give us some clues about how to get along in in diversity. But but with the gender, I just feel like if we make bus this move into saying there really is no such thing, we're gonna miss out Well, I actually don't think it can work at all because we're going to miss out on who we really are.
And I believe that if we could express to people, modern modern world people, what the possibilities are for fully claiming and embodying and being empowered by your gender in a way that I was just speaking of like say for the women on their moon time, whoever can bleed. I mean, that's a very distinct group. That's not on a cultural construct, I think we may change our mind about doing away with gender.
Dorothee: Yeah. And perhaps even expand what our current very rigid definition of what a woman is. Maybe expanding that to make room for more expressions of being a woman. And it sounds like in modern times, we are missing out on a lot of the gifts and the beauty of what woman can offer to the community. So it's like right now we're like looking through a tiny little window, but there's like a whole sky of possibilities of expressing that.
Woman Stands Shining: Yes. Exactly. It's been very, very, very restricted. And again, lots of illusions, delusions, and deceptions involved. Mhmm.
I mean, if you wanna trick humanity out of life, one of the primary things you're gonna have to do is you're gonna to take the women down -- Mhmm. -- because mama bear doesn't give up life very easy.
Dorothee: So true. I wanted to touch on something briefly that I've heard you talk about in regard to women who are on their moon. And and before I say that, I wanna also just say, I've had a lot of requests from my listeners to get more information and conversation about that menopause phase of a woman's life. So I just wanna tell all those women listening. I'm definitely looking into that and, you know, maybe one day we can have women stand shining come back.
And talk about her experience there, but but that will definitely happen because I I see such a need and such a longing from women in our culture to really dive into more understanding around that phase. But But in regard to to the women on their moon time, I have heard you talk a little bit about the way that sometimes women will, you know, drink caffeine or they'll eat chocolate or basically they'll they'll kind of look towards pushing through or taking stimulants to kind of like get out of that dreamy restful state, which I'm hearing you say is actually incredibly sacred place to be. And I think, you know, given our our modern life, and we've talked about this in past shows that I've done here that, you know, we're just oh, while we still have to get up and go to work and perform and check our email and do all this stuff, I'm just thinking about, you know, what your advice might be around how do we settle into that energy and just actually work with it instead of being like, okay. Shoot. I'm I'm too, like, calm and restful.
Are I, you know, for me personally, I wanna just sit on the earth. Like, I just want to sit on the earth and do nothing else. But of course, my cultures, like, well, you're not allowed to sit on the earth and do nothing else. Like, you have things to do. You have money to make.
Like, what's happening? So, yeah, I'm just wondering what your thoughts about that are.
Woman Stands Shining: Well, listening to you describe that just now, I'm like, well, I think we're all going to be presented with some big big choices about whether we stay with business as usual or whether we really respond to I mean, eventually, we're gonna have to respond. The question is, are we gonna wait until it's there's no other option, meaning these earth changes become so big that nobody's getting up and going to the office every day. Or are we gonna take that action before we come to that place? And So, yeah, there's there's that. But But I you know, one of the stories I tell is that I as I applied for a job after I had started going into the village, and I And in my job interview, I I said, you know, I would like you to understand that if I come to work for you, that I will be taking four days out of the month, out of the office way to stay with my moon launch prayer, and he won't regret it. I promise you. And I got hired. And I know I told that story at one time. And to be honest, I don't know if this person was already doing it or whether they heard that and they decided, but I know there's some fairly large business of some kind like corporate thing, I think, in England And I think it's out of Brighton where that's their company policy. No. So there's that as well.
And and I guess as for taking stimulants to get yourself out of that dreamy state? Well, Well, right. I mean, it's a we we are at that fork in the road. It's a it's a kind of commitment. It's like, well, do do can I be a part of allowing the earth to speak to me on a regular basis or, you know, I mean, I don't really know on one level, and I know this isn't very practical in some ways, but it's actually ultimately the most practical I don't really know what could be more important at this point than listening to the earth?
If you have an ability to listen to the earth and receive her instruction, I just can't imagine what could be more important than that. In the state that we're in at this moment. Right? So, yeah, I think as I so one thing that I tell women, I try to remember to tell them before I put them in a moonlight as I say, I want you to know. I know this sounds like really, really groovy and everything, but you really need to know this is gonna rock your world and this is gonna change your life. If you go into this moon lodge, your moon lodge your moon will never allow you to do what you did with it before. It just won't allow it. Once you acknowledge it in ceremony, she's like, oh, okay.
Now I know that you know, then, no, we're not we're not just gonna go with the program ever again. No. And and that's God's honest truth. And and it's not got nothing to do with me putting you in there. It's just just the way it is.
It's like our bodies are so ready and made to do it that that's how it is. And so I think for me, that's what happens as much as it being a somewhat conscious choice. There was this relentless urging from my own spirit and body to make room for it. So I guess, as I think back on it, by acknowledging that place in my world, then my whole world began to shift and change and move around it so that my work began to change, how I worked began to change. And as I was able to bring that into a much higher priority, if not the highest priority.
Then the way I began to work changed. And so automatically, it started kicking me out of the system. It was kind of a gradual process, but it but it did happen. I mean, and now my world is like, yeah, it's not in the box in any way at all right now, happily. But sometimes, it's it's a little stressful, but but mostly happily.
So I and my moon did that for me. My moon is just so smart. She's so she's like the wisest girl ever. And she takes care of me and she leads me and she has saved me from terrible horrors a few times. And so, yeah, there this relationship and this trust about her and and where she's what she's insisting on has grown or grew over the last years of my move time.
I'd say it was about twelve years or so. And, yeah, really beautiful. But as but specifically about things to eat, you know, I know women say that moon time and chocolate go together. But I will say that, you know, I experienced this incredibly deep moon launch. It was my first full on in full ceremony setting.
Moon Lodge with these women and we were brought all of our meals and nobody was allowed to leave that space. Until they showed no signs of blood for twenty four hours. So it was kind of a strict strictly held moon lodge and Anyway, in that one, we just went so deep. We synchronized in the most incredible way in a way I've never experienced with women. I mean, it only makes sense.
Right? Like, why is it that when we all work in the same place that we all start moving at the same time? You know? So clearly, there's a buy buy biological imperative for us to be together. And, well, I would say dream and vision.
Together for the people at that time. And so anyway, we started moving in this incredible synchronicity, like sleeping at the same time, waking at the same time. At one time, we all got sick to our stomach at the same time, which this very wise spiritual leader heard, you know, was told about and and so therefore called everybody to go in the sweat. So, yeah, we were in this incredibly deep synchronicity. And then there was this cooler in the midst of us and we realized that we had never opened it.
And so we were asking, well, who's cooler is this? Is it yours? Is it yours? No. It's not mine.
And and turned out didn't belong to any of us. So we said, wow. They must have left it here for us, so we haven't ever looked in it. So we looked in it, and it was filled with chocolate and sodas. And so some of the women decided that they were going to have some and some of us didn't, but it was so clear the the the moment we began to ingest that sugar, all the synchronicity stopped.
Just stopped. And I thought, wow, that explains so much of the world in general. That sugar is a very disruptive thing. So anyway, sorry, bad news, ladies, chocolate, and one time, I'm not so Sure. I'm not so sure.
Dorothee: I I'm so grateful for that for that perspective and that information because I think that there's just so much that we can be doing to supporting ourselves in service to our communities that we just haven't been taught. Many of us And yet, yeah, people like you and cultures that still have that connection hold a lot I think we only have a few minutes left, and I wanted to know if there's anything that is in your mind, in your heart that you'd like to share before we conclude today? A couple of things. You know,
Woman Stands Shining: I I was having lunch with a really beautiful poet friend of mine from the Bay Area. And she was describing how she was dreaming of doing this course out here at Ghost Ranch in New Mexico, and she kept apologizing, oh, that probably sounds really random or, oh, that probably sounds really unclear or, you know, I just kept noticing. She was apologizing. And so when she finally finished, I was telling her, well, first of all, I just wanna tell you that your process does not sound random or scattered or anything. It's just what I'm hearing in your process is it's inclusive of so many things that many people don't include when they're thinking about developing a course.
And to me, that's a feminine way of putting things together. And and so I I keep my ear out for it. And I really like to reflect back to women. Like, no. That that makes total sense to me.
And I don't I just for my sake, I don't feel like you need to apologize for that process. And so one thing I've been saying to men's nation is as I've been saying, you know, so coming out of Moon Lodge, I'll always ask the women, is there anything that you wanna say to me? Just one on one or to the to the women or to the whole community, you know? Because often people will go into the lunch when when I'm running sweatlodge for everybody else. And and and they they're always hesitant, you know.
And and usually, they'll say something like, well, this doesn't sound like anything, but it just seems so urgent and important at the time. And usually the phrase of what they say is is sort of simple and in some ways obvious, like you were saying, it's just it's just about clicking that memory. Oh, oh, right. Right. Right.
Right. And so I feel like the women come out of their moon time and they and they'll have a phrase like that, but they're so hesitant to say it. And I'm always so grateful when they're willing to go ahead and say it out loud. But that's a practice that we're getting used to. And that was part of why the witch hunts, I think, had to be addressed and healing work had to be done was because that time definitely seared into our cellular memory, you know, what can happen if you speak?
So there's many things that are working against that voice. And yet, that voice is so so clear and powerful when it when we can finally allow it And so what I've been saying to men's nation is that, you know, when the women come out of these, as the women are remembering, more and more about who we are and what our role is. And as we enacted, you know, what I notice is that when they come out of these things, you know, what their speech isn't always linear and they're also battling a fear because they they don't have much practice at it. And they're overcoming a lot of historical trauma to speak it. So it doesn't always come out linear for those reasons, but it but it's not really a linear process. Any either.
So, you know, it doesn't they rarely come out with, you know, power points and bulleted points you know, it doesn't it just doesn't come out that way. And I say, so you gotta recognize that that is a masculine form language that we have all been indoctrinated into. So I'm asking you to to to recognize that. And so when the women speak, you know, let let us have our speech. We need to have our speech again.
And I say to them, you know, I come from a people whose children by law could be kidnapped by government officials or missionaries. And taken to their schools. And when they were in those schools, they were not allowed to speak their first language are our indigenous languages. I mean, they were literally had bars of soap in their mouth. They were they were beaten.
They were, you know, I mean, it it was they just were not allowed. And so if these languages contain all of that incredible science of how to be here, all that thousands of years of knowledge, think of everything that we have lost by those languages being suppressed and beaten out of us. We lost so much And so I know what that is. And what I wanna say to the world right now is we need the feminine language. Again, it's the same thing.
All the wisdom, all the understanding, all the instruction from the Mother Earth, all the faith keeping language, all the relational language that we have been missing we need it again. And so tell them, don't make us speak like you. Don't insist that we use your language let us have our language and you come our way, come our way, and listen. And when you don't get it and you don't understand it first time around, rather than just roll your eyes and say, okay. Anyways, we're just gonna move right along here.
Like, rather than do that, like, sometimes men ask me, what can I do to support the women, and this is one of the things I tell them they can do? I say, you know, instead say, I'm sorry, I didn't understand that. Could you please say that again? That's a revolutionary act for this life, I think. And so, you know, I'm I'm really thinking a lot about the women's speech. And I feel like I have a gift of being able to speak the women's speech in a linear way if need be. Mhmm. So So I can do that, but not everybody can do that, and not everybody should do that.
Sometimes I feel like I'm translating some part of indigenous culture to modern world, and I have an ability to do that. But not everybody can do that and not everybody should do that. So there's a there's a power there.
Dorothee: Thank you so much woman stand shining for telling these stories, sharing your life experience, and thank you also to the grandmother's and to mother earth are making all of this possible. I know that the women listening and maybe some men also will be really grateful to to have experienced this. So thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Woman Stands Shining: My honor and my pleasure and we come from a long a long line of travel, and we may have a long line of travel ahead, but we are fully equipped and in fact, we are born into beauty as beauty for joyful life. So thank you so much, Dorothee.
Dorothee: Thank you for listening to the show. You can hear more episodes on moonwise.com or subscribe to the Moonwise podcast on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. If you enjoyed the episode, leave us a written review on Apple Podcasts and get a shout out on the show. Reviews help others find the podcast, and I read each and everyone. Thank you so much for your support.
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